Subject: Re: [LINUX:7695] Re: [linux.org.tr] (fwd)
From: Andreas Mueller (amu@bimel.com.tr)
Date: Wed 21 Jul 1999 - 12:32:38 EET DST
On Wed, 21 Jul 1999, Ozgur C. Demir wrote:
Hi
> > TRLUUG, both of them are personal friends of mine. There were no
> > discussion between users and officials before, the fee was simply
> > dictated.
>
> The word `dictated' is extremelly wrong for this subject. While deciding
> this, Every Linux list members are invited to meeting for organizing a
> Turkish Linux Group Management Committee via E-mail. Meetings place, date
> and time was announced in list. Every person who joins the meeting could
> vote for decisions. And i personnaly reject the word `Dictated'.
Sorry, i`m also an member, other also, is not every person which is
interested about Linux, an Part of Linux-Tuerkiye ?
You HAVE to tell every person about YOUR plans, at least such an
importend thing announced at www.linux.org.tr, with the possibility
for an voting System.
I know nothing about this Meeting. Also other closed friends
>
> This Community need somethings which all known by everbody such as,
> 1. A Continuous income,
It not possible with an linux.org Domain
> 2. A Website which updates everyday *or two times in a week at least*
the German Linux-Page is updated hourly :-)
> 3. To become an authority about Linux in Turkey
Now your kindly and stupid
arx, maybe invest much more time with coding _for_ linux, stop the stupid
disscussions and start to work.
> These needs does exist for years. Everybody in Turkish Linux Community try
> to solve these problems until now. But no one could. So, at the last
> meeting, community decided to solve these problems this way.
>
An poor argument, i posted this thread also to slashdot the hole world
start to smile about _your_ Ideas. Maybe your invest more enery
_for_ Linux.How do you think Linux is Developed ? It`s developed
by everyone`s personal enery without any commercial mind.
> If anyone thoughts this way is wrong, he must show another way.
Whats about Courses, monthly Meetings, building local User Groups,
an Web-List with ( their Telefon+E-mail ) people which are able to help
diffent topics. Rent an Installation Set for Free for people which have
less moeny. Mountly FAQ`s posting. Give people information about SPAM
Offer an SPAM Free Country like Europe, US ... There are many Ideas BUT
you just MAKE it, if your discuss or think how i`m going to be rich,
is the wrong way.
>
> > a) To hire a partime student. I know that there are many students
> > who create webpages for free projects for free. (Look at
> > http://www.debian.org/ for example)
>
> Until now, some of our friends tried to update Linux.org.tr website, but
> it is not enough to keep updated a serious web site. It anyone accepts to
> create web pages for Linux.org.tr as a serious job, there are no problem
> for anyone.
if i hear "some of our friends", if linux.org.tr needs help for
WEBdeveloping anncounce THIS, and you find people , but if your friend is
busy theres is still all time this lag. Dammed linux.org.tr is not your
private gambling area.
I know minimum 5 People which are able to help, i think just in this List
you find minimum 2 people, or ?
> > b) In a free group (like the Linux community) all email addresses
> > have some "worth". It doesn't make sense to create subdomains
> > within such a linux.<tld> domain. We don't need a new two-level
> > hierarchy.
>
> This structure was not accepted in last meeting, these subdomains already
> exist for months.
>
why ? theres no technical reason
> > c) Maybe comming soon, members.linux.org.tr will also be splitted
> > into active and passive, stupid and clever.
>
> maybe funny or boring. ocd@boring.linux.org.tr fits me, isnt it ?
> Please, understand the point, we dont try to categorize people.
>
hahaha but why your try to do this ?
> > d) Mr. Gorkem does his job all for free. If he can't do this
> > anymore, we have to look for somebody else. There are many people
> > who would like to help.
>
> Hmm, i remember Gorkem was there with us while meeting. And he approved
> all decisions as i remember.
> You say "there are many people who would like to help", but we cant found
> them ? where ? we all open to help, please let us know.
>
> > f) Support for Linux. There are three commercial companies at
> > Tuerkiye, that provide professional support for Linux. One of
> > them, I support with FREE bandwith, with a computer hosted in our
> > network. The other is the company I work for, we also give FREE
> > support for Linux, including freebies for people who can't afford
> > purchasing a CD.
>
> The objective of Turkish Linux Community is being authorative in Turkey.
> If you say "We supported Linux in Turkey", the founding you have to supprt
> is not a commerical founding. Noone can say anything your relationship
> with any assocation but with this relationship you cant say " We support
> Linux in Turkey".
>
> > A short time ago I started a new project to translate Debian into
> > Turkish. This includes webpages as well, I searched for peoples who
> > can help. I found 40 (fourty) people who wanted to work on this this
> > project FOR FREE. They spend their time thats all. I also invited
> > the German Linux Community to Tuerkiye last year. 20 people have had
> > very much fun time. The Sponsors were the airplane company Akdeniz, a
> > local HighSchool, the German Unix User Group and myself. I even have
> > paid for hotel and meal for the Turkish people out of my own pocket.
>
> We all thankful to you.
>
> > My personal activity for Linux at Tuerkiye is very, very HIGH.
> > Richard Stallman visited Tuerkiye one month ago. Now linux.org.tr
> > acts like a commercial company. Is this what we deserve?
>
> No, you are wrong.. this activity cannot define as "Commercial Company"
>
*g* i spoke before, with importend people at Linux-Realted things,
all of them agreed, that THIS is more more Step Linux.org.tr is going
to be comercial.
We decided to put this Articel to Slashdot, i dont know if you know
Linus has iirc and what else can happen. If you keep linux.org.tr as an
non-free Organisation, I`M your biggest enemy. And i`ll do all things
to stop you !
> > I don't believe so. If your new plan to make Linux much more
> > attractive, please walk around and ask people who would work for
> > FREE. I'm sure you can find people. You can also find sponsors. For
> > example, when Richard Stallman visited Turkiye, I asked my boss if we
> > could provide him a car. He agreed,
>
> Linux community was wait idle for only this. "walking around and ask
> people "What will we do?", the condition is the result.
YOUR have no plan how an organisation works.Still is very lagy,
but your MUST ask the/all pleople what they think/wish AND if your
cant accept, build our own Company and play insite your Organisation
the Big Boss, but NOT undercover Linux.
> > It's also serious that there's no protocol about your meeting or other
> > people don't know about this secret event. At least the situation
> > very dim about what happend with linux.org.tr and I cannot accept this
> > situation. Dont forget Linux is an operating system developed by
> > many, many people and these people invested _their_ free time to
> > develop it. I'll also say thanks that I'm able to choose to use this
> > great product for FREE.
>
> It was not secret. Well known by everbody who reads the list.
>
> > Maybe linux.org.tr needs new Ideas, but if you get money from
> > individuals this is the wrong way. Other people replied to me with a
> > "big thank" for my posting, but they hesitated to post themselves such
> > a letter. Please think again about your ideas for linux.org.tr.
>
> Maybe... please let us know if you have any.
^^
us .. dammed we ALL are the linux-family not YOU`R
> Ozgur C. Demir
> Koc.NET
P.S. if your work at KOC ? Your ask your Bosses what they can do for Linux
? Your Arguments are still poor.
At least i give your time until end of this Week to think again.
And pease dont post your result, not to an random-choosed Maillinglist
there`s an www.linux.org.tr you have to announce this at this page.
IF your not responsable for this disaster, forward the mail to somebody
which is able to decide, i`ll wait for answer.
cu
Andreas Mueller
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